Another 70 wagoneer build

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Kaiserjeeps
    360 AMC
    • Oct 02, 2002
    • 2809

    I was hoping to get a post up soon. Busy is not the word for the last few weeks. I am almost done with my dads estate and I have been repairing everything from the neighborhood fire tanker truck from freeze damage to my moms subaru wagon so I can give it to my cousin who just had her transmission puke in her car. I don't want to give her a project she can't afford to fix. I believe I am just about caught up. So I took the grills back to the powder coater this last week. I should hear back real soon and will go pick them up. I found a satin black cerakote coating that looks exactly like the black on the grills. I did a compatibility test and it passed with flying colors. Bad PUN eh? The grills are going to be coated with a polyurethane clear. I had to make sure no wrinkling or problems would surface.

    The test card they gave me.



    I coated all the grill steel parts with it. According to the BATF using cerakote is gunsmithing activity. So when I say this will be a high caliber wagoneer, I am dead serious.



    Now I have been doing a ton of online research and looking for the correct semi tubular rivets to put all the parts back together again. I found a very cool company. They are incredibly helpful and I am still waiting for the recent order I placed for the larger grill rivets. The division bars rivet order I placed for all four doors did come in and he included a ton of samples to see if they would help with the work.
    This is the company.


    So I proceeded to replace the division bars on the rear doors. Now Team Grand Wagoneer sells these but I am tired of them. I ordered both metro molded parts (# WC-29-72) at 54 bucks, and Standard Products (Y 658X-72) at 33.95 bucks. There is a slight and probably insignificant difference. Standards have longer felts or whiskers.
    If you order either or call the company and have them cut the 72 incher in half. You will still cut off about 4 inches for the final product. This will save a bundle on shipping and less chance of UPS ruining it like they like to do.



    Metro has shorter whiskers.



    I am putting the Metro division bars on the rear doors because they have extra linkage to make the window raise and lower. The front doors will get the Standard Products because there is only one lifter arm. I did test fit the bars on the windows and there is a slight difference in drag.

    So Using the new brake lining super small semi tubular rivets and a really nice setting tool from Aircraft Spruce, I was able to duplicate the factory roll on the rivets without to much trouble. Jay Cee rivet company did send a setting tool that can be used with a hammer. I discovered the screw type and went after it. It was less than 40 bucks and works like a charm.
    Do not bother with the cheaper one. It had bad reviews and this one did not.



    I had to make a taller die to fit inside the division bar channel. I found a ruined riding lawn mower blade spindle that was hardened and it worked perfectly. It took a while with slow machining because it was hardened. But it will and has worked perfectly. The original is on the left.



    So I marked and drilled out each hole to the exact same size as factory. I had trouble with the new whiskers being in the way till I figured out I could shear it with a punch and some twisting. It left a perfectly clean hole to insert the rivet in.



    And putting it all back together. Look at all those samples they sent me.



    So after doing both rear doors and a polish of the stainless on the buffer, I now have two completely rebuilt rear window glass assemblies. Now I need to figure out how to get all this in the door shell without ruining the wide lower glass seal. Trust me I have tried. I will figure it out.



    It worked well. Very tight




    EDIT: 11/30/19 Rivet part number that I reduced the head size in the lathe is BR4-3B however these should work with no machining, The part number is T140B001870 and it the same basic rivet except has a very slightly crowned head. It should not interfere with the glass. Rivets bought from rivetsonline.com
    The rivet tool was bought from aircraft spruce and is in the rivet tools section. You can remove the screw drive rivet set part of the tool and use a ball peen hammer to drive the rivets the tool can't reach.
    End of edit....

    I discovered the rivet tool will not work on the very top part of the front division bars. The angle of the vent glass and frame is in the way of the rivets. I have another tool on the way that I needed for the grill rivets. I hope it fits these. I may have to bend the metal frame part like the rear ones. One of the pictures above shows this minor bend. Except it will be a major bend if that is what I have to do. Hope not.

    I have been making a plan for mounting the poly aftermarket gas tank. Sadie arrived at my shop with it. The mounts were not optimum. And I am making a new metal filler pipe out of mandrel bent 1.75 inch 16 GA steel pipe. The filler pipe from the rubber neck to the tank. The original was missing and the factory filler pipe is 1.5 inch with shrunken corners from the factory bender down to about 1 1/4 inch. So hopefully the bigger size and being mandrel bent will flow gas with some respectable speed. I am waiting for that to show up. I ordered some 3/4 gas vent hose from this very cool place. Gas tank parts O Rama!

    We Stock The Largest Selection Of Reducers, Joyner's and Couplings On The Market. Factory Direct Pricing. Ships Out Same Or Next Business Day.


    I also have my eye on a large single round dual inlet and dual outlet muffler for getting the exhaust done soon. It will be mandrel bent 2 1/4 pipe dual exhaust all the way back. Everything needs to be installed before exhaust gets ran. The engine compartment is just about done. I still need to rebuild the 4 barrel Rochester and get the matching air cleaner housing painted. I had to order a 11 MM alternator pulley. The alternator showed up with a 10MM and I ordered a 13MM thinking that was like original. It was to big. Two orders later I got it right. The belt sits like it should now. Same as the crankshaft and water pump pulleys.

    I also unwrapped all of the ribbed aluminum panels I bought hoping to get at least one set of tailgate panels. No way as literally all of it was scratched. What a waste. I hope to get the replacement order in soon. And that it is all in good shape.

    I need to go scratch all my bug bites now. More later.
    Last edited by Kaiserjeeps; 11-30-2019, 11:29 AM.
    Melford1972 says...
    I’d say I feel sorry for you, but I really don’t, Mr. “I-stumble-into-X-models-the-way-most-people-stumble-into-Toyota-Carollas.” 🤣
    -----------------------
    I make wag parts
    1969 CJ-5 41 years owned
    1969 1414X Wag in avocado mist
    1970 1414X Wag in avocado mist
    1968 M715 restomod
    2001 Dodge 3500
    2002 Toyota Tundra
    2006 Toyota 4runner was Liz's, parked



    Building a m715 over at the m715zone
    Beloved wife Elizabeth Ann Temple Murdered by covid on Oct 19th 2021

    Small violin, large amp

    Comment

    • SJTD
      304 AMC
      • Apr 26, 2012
      • 1953

      Looks like original.

      When I replaced the window channels on my '63 Ford PU about 35 years ago I had to buy two rights from Ford and remove one channel from the frame and install it in the other.

      No internet back then to find all this aftermarket stuff.

      I just used pop rivets. Had to make an extension to fit down between the felt.
      Sic friatur crustulum

      '84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.

      Comment

      • Kaiserjeeps
        360 AMC
        • Oct 02, 2002
        • 2809

        I might have put a bit more pressure than I needed to. I also wondered about a light coat of 30 WT oil on the upper die. I think I will try that on the fronts.
        No room for pop rivets under the rubber glass seals. That would have been a lot easier and cheaper. This is all good stuff though. Now I can set rivets on other things too.

        And I wonder how we got anything done pre internet. It was a lot of phone calls and only half the results. I am amazed what can be found online now. But that is about all I appreciate about the internet. If it were not for the dozens of projects I have going I think I would avoid it. Everything has it's good and bad though.
        Several of Sadies parts came from around the world. So I guess I am indeed grateful for being able to find them.

        I hope the grills get done this week. The powder coater is prompt.
        The plastic parts (armrest ends, fender reflectors, etc) I am having plated should be done after next week. 5 Months they have been there.
        Onward.
        Melford1972 says...
        I’d say I feel sorry for you, but I really don’t, Mr. “I-stumble-into-X-models-the-way-most-people-stumble-into-Toyota-Carollas.” 🤣
        -----------------------
        I make wag parts
        1969 CJ-5 41 years owned
        1969 1414X Wag in avocado mist
        1970 1414X Wag in avocado mist
        1968 M715 restomod
        2001 Dodge 3500
        2002 Toyota Tundra
        2006 Toyota 4runner was Liz's, parked



        Building a m715 over at the m715zone
        Beloved wife Elizabeth Ann Temple Murdered by covid on Oct 19th 2021

        Small violin, large amp

        Comment

        • toddthewelder
          258 I6
          • Dec 30, 2010
          • 413

          You are always just in time, I just got my rear division bars in and was trying to figure out how I was going to rivet them back together. I also ordered a set of window regulators from speedway, they are universal but I think they will work perfect after I make a new bracket.
          80 cj 5
          87 GW
          Another 87 GW
          88 GW
          99 Wrangler
          07 Dodge 3500
          67 Chevy SWB
          2 furry shop bosses (Ash & Duke(RIP 2/13/16))

          Comment

          • Kaiserjeeps
            360 AMC
            • Oct 02, 2002
            • 2809

            Always trying to be of service. That rapco brake rivet tool is nicely made. They have another just like it that is probably china made. It had poor reviews. So you can't go wrong for 37 bucks on the better unit. If you need rivet detail, let me know. And I have some mower spindle left. If you need a tall post adapter for the rapco tool, again let me know.
            I am finally getting the front vent window parts to separate. So I can slip the new rubber on the frame. There is a lot of casting slag on the new rubber. Better than nothing I suppose.
            Melford1972 says...
            I’d say I feel sorry for you, but I really don’t, Mr. “I-stumble-into-X-models-the-way-most-people-stumble-into-Toyota-Carollas.” 🤣
            -----------------------
            I make wag parts
            1969 CJ-5 41 years owned
            1969 1414X Wag in avocado mist
            1970 1414X Wag in avocado mist
            1968 M715 restomod
            2001 Dodge 3500
            2002 Toyota Tundra
            2006 Toyota 4runner was Liz's, parked



            Building a m715 over at the m715zone
            Beloved wife Elizabeth Ann Temple Murdered by covid on Oct 19th 2021

            Small violin, large amp

            Comment

            • toddthewelder
              258 I6
              • Dec 30, 2010
              • 413

              Originally posted by Kaiserjeeps
              Always trying to be of service. I have some mower spindle left. If you need a tall post adapter for the rapco tool, again let me know.
              I am finally getting the front vent window parts to separate. So I can slip the new rubber on the frame. There is a lot of casting slag on the new rubber. Better than nothing I suppose.
              Al, you have been a great service to everyone in the FSJ community. I'm going to go ahead and say yes I will need the post adapter, just let me know how much and PM me your paypal info and I'll send some $$$ and a shipping address. Thanks for all the help
              80 cj 5
              87 GW
              Another 87 GW
              88 GW
              99 Wrangler
              07 Dodge 3500
              67 Chevy SWB
              2 furry shop bosses (Ash & Duke(RIP 2/13/16))

              Comment

              • rang-a-stang
                Administrator
                • Oct 31, 2016
                • 5509

                Originally posted by toddthewelder
                Al, you have been a great service to everyone in the FSJ community....Thanks for all the help
                Concur. there are so many bits of "how to" in this build alone, it's worth the investment watching. So awesome.
                Chuck McTruck 71 J4000
                (Chuck McTruck Build Thread)
                (8.1L swap questions - PerformanceTrucks.net Forums​)
                79 Cherokee Chief (SOLD, goodbye old buddy)
                (Cherokee Build Thread)
                11 Nissan Pathfinder Silver Edition 4x4
                09 Mazdaspeed3 Grand Touring
                00 Baby Cherokee

                Comment

                • Kaiserjeeps
                  360 AMC
                  • Oct 02, 2002
                  • 2809

                  Thanks guys. It is good to share info. When I lived on the m715 zone there was a guy who would post up a lot of great stuff. When asked how he made it happen he would come right out and say I'm not telling. But if you send me your truck/parts I will fix it for you for a (way to high) fee. We kept telling him what a tool he was being and some people you just can't reach. That is one of the very drivers for me to spread info to enable others to not have to go through the same trials. Just a little back ground there...

                  So what a day. While trying to get to sleep every night after I say thanks for all the good stuff, I work through the challenges till I think I have a plan. Well it paid off. I was able to figure out how to install the wide lower rear stationary window seal in place with total ease. With zero flexing or stress on an already brittle old seal. I left my camera in the shop so I can post detail tomorrow. I was able to load up the passenger rear door complete with window wipes. I am very disappointed both with the window wipes and the window guide felt insert for the door frame. It won't tuck all the way into the door frame. And, the window won't close all the way. The division bar repair side worked great. But, It is tight to roll up and down because of the replacement felt on the front and top side of the door. I will look at it again tomorrow and post up when I have pictures and hopefully a better working assembly. I may have to source and order better fitting material.

                  Todd please PM me your shipping address.
                  Melford1972 says...
                  I’d say I feel sorry for you, but I really don’t, Mr. “I-stumble-into-X-models-the-way-most-people-stumble-into-Toyota-Carollas.” 🤣
                  -----------------------
                  I make wag parts
                  1969 CJ-5 41 years owned
                  1969 1414X Wag in avocado mist
                  1970 1414X Wag in avocado mist
                  1968 M715 restomod
                  2001 Dodge 3500
                  2002 Toyota Tundra
                  2006 Toyota 4runner was Liz's, parked



                  Building a m715 over at the m715zone
                  Beloved wife Elizabeth Ann Temple Murdered by covid on Oct 19th 2021

                  Small violin, large amp

                  Comment

                  • Frank Ziebert
                    327 Rambler
                    • Dec 04, 2016
                    • 620

                    Great to see you make such progress Al.
                    Too bad the work season is so short--you know the time between snowed and and fighting fires
                    1970 J2000(2500) Currently undergoing frame off resto
                    Stinger 2005 Jeep Unlimited, Sahara, Rubicon slightly modified

                    Comment

                    • Kaiserjeeps
                      360 AMC
                      • Oct 02, 2002
                      • 2809

                      We had snow a month ago. It has been over 90 several times now. I hope this is not a bad fire season. I have a very long list of must do's for the home.
                      Thanks for the reminder Frank.

                      ******

                      So some discoveries on what is not quite right with the door loading lately. I found what is the problem and was able to remedy most of it today. To start with I have been putting roadkill sound deadener in the doors before putting anything in. Hopefully the addition of this stuff will make it ride quiet.




                      Bring bandaids. The foil is sharp as a razor. I have shed a lot for blood for this build.

                      Cut to shape and pressed in. Maximum bond in 72 hours.



                      Then here is what was troubling me for how to get it done without damaging the older rubber. I used to force the lower seal down through the door when taking them apart. That trashes them. I tried easing it up through the window gap and so far none of them have done well. Somewhere there is a 95 year old person who did this all day quickly at the Jeep factory. I kept thinking about how it must have been done. It worked and here is what I did for the rear doors stationary windows.

                      Install the window frame and turn it upside down on a table and apply duct tape to the top and back of the frame. This is to keep the glass from moving on you later.



                      Take the new division bar and stainless including the seal off. Insert the division bar and the taped window plus frame into the door. Attach the top of the division bar with the two screws.



                      Insert the assembly in the door frame and screw in the three mini countersunk screws that hold this in. Then carefully pull the division bar and rubber seal back lightly bending the upper part you just screwed together. Have very soapy water handy and soak the stationary window frame, glass, and the wide rubber seal on both sides with lots of soap. While pulling back on the division bar ease the rubber strip into the frame and under the glass. It helped to reach into the door and with a finger pull the metal frame down to widen the gap between the glass and frame. Start pushing the seal into place. Run it all the way home.



                      Soak the division bar rubber seal groove and the glass edge with soapy water. Ease the division bar back in place making sure the lower mount with the two screw holes makes it under the frame and not between the frame and seal.

                      Install the window glass in the door and carefully rotate it to the correct orientation with the slotted channel "U" shape facing the outer door skin.
                      Slip the glass into the door frame new window glass channel felt. Make sure it is all the way in. Reach in the door and twist the new division bar easing the glass into the lower part of the new division bar. Work it up the glass and when you get to the top of the glass it helps to lift that end of the glass window to help it snap into the groove. Here is the fun part. Get a flashlight and a mirror, a really long phillips screwdriver and put one of the two screws on the screwdriver. Using the mirror ease the screw up into either one of the mounting holes for the window frame. Don't put these screws in before this as the division bar needs to twist to get the glass back in. This is what it looks like done and tight. Now you can lower the glass and put the bottom division bar angle mount on securing the division bar permanently to the inner door skin.



                      So it worked great. No forcing much of anything.
                      Now the glass run channels are aftermarket. They just do not fit well. It makes the window super tight and looks bad. I don't know if the suppliers all sell the same thing, but I suspect they do. This is what I found.

                      The aftermarket channel has an extra rib on each side. This does not allow the new glass run to seat into the door right. You can try all you want. It won't go in. A very poor fit.



                      I went and got an old door. I pulled out and cut off about an inch of factory stuff. This is how it is supposed to fit. Look at the sides. They are snug in the frame.



                      A total pain but I decided to try and shave both sides of the new product down. It was hard to not gouge rubber I wanted to leave alone. Fortunately it is all hidden.



                      I mounted the rubber in a vise and did it again. The flatter you get this the better it will fit. Here is the rubber flap all shaved off. Now we are talking!



                      Look how much better it fits. Like it should have out of the package.



                      The drivers rear door window now will slowly fall under it's own weight eventually ending up all the way open. I had to tape it up to load out the rest of the parts in the door. It works just great now.

                      The window wipes I bought are still marginal. I am not happy with them. At least the window can be used now. But the wipes make it worse than it should be.

                      I will be looking for a better match for glass run channel. If I find it I may start selling it or post up the better product. I doubt I will be notifying the two FSJ suppliers as they can source their own. Who ever thought the stuff currently being sold was good enough was wrong. It does not work without major shaving and does not even come close to fitting the door frame.

                      That is all I have today. I thought I would be done with the doors by now. Story of my life.
                      Melford1972 says...
                      I’d say I feel sorry for you, but I really don’t, Mr. “I-stumble-into-X-models-the-way-most-people-stumble-into-Toyota-Carollas.” 🤣
                      -----------------------
                      I make wag parts
                      1969 CJ-5 41 years owned
                      1969 1414X Wag in avocado mist
                      1970 1414X Wag in avocado mist
                      1968 M715 restomod
                      2001 Dodge 3500
                      2002 Toyota Tundra
                      2006 Toyota 4runner was Liz's, parked



                      Building a m715 over at the m715zone
                      Beloved wife Elizabeth Ann Temple Murdered by covid on Oct 19th 2021

                      Small violin, large amp

                      Comment

                      • toddthewelder
                        258 I6
                        • Dec 30, 2010
                        • 413

                        I'm not impressed with how mine fits either, I may be trying your trick. Why doesn't anyone make the seal for the stationary window?
                        80 cj 5
                        87 GW
                        Another 87 GW
                        88 GW
                        99 Wrangler
                        07 Dodge 3500
                        67 Chevy SWB
                        2 furry shop bosses (Ash & Duke(RIP 2/13/16))

                        Comment

                        • 81jseries
                          232 I6
                          • Aug 31, 2001
                          • 148

                          I'm always impressed with your attention to the smallest details. That roadkill stuff looks interesting, going to look into that now.
                          67 wagoneer - GTO 389 & 4spd

                          Comment

                          • SOLSAKS
                            304 AMC
                            • Jul 25, 2016
                            • 1781

                            dang,......

                            wonderful work on everything
                            the lettering in the chrome badges looks great.

                            cant wait to see the full view of this FSJ when complete.

                            thanx for posting for us to enjoy.

                            dave in NC
                            SOLSAKS - dave
                            1976 J-10 HONCHO Fleetside
                            1982 J-10 Fleetside
                            1988 grand wagoneer
                            2004 RUBICON jeep
                            Benson, NC

                            Comment

                            • Kaiserjeeps
                              360 AMC
                              • Oct 02, 2002
                              • 2809

                              I enjoy the this too Dave. I just wish I was a little quicker to produce....

                              *****
                              So lookie here. I got a call from Glenn at G-car that my plastic parts were done. It has been a bit as he is super busy. I can say that good things do take time.
                              I drove out to his shop and picked everything up.
                              These parts look better than the metal parts I had chromed. I was darn near stunned.



                              With some new reflectors...



                              And wow.... Even though Sadie is getting a NOS glove box door clock, I had two of these done for Sadie and myself. I think these look better than factory ones.



                              And of course I had 8 arm rest ends done for the build there in the background. Everything looks great.

                              Here is the place. He is very busy, Expect to wait some.

                              We specialize in the quality repair, chroming and refinishing of your muscle car plastic interior trim. Late model and import vehicles as well.


                              So I have been taking apart the wing window assemblies. But not before a plan on getting them back together. I had to bend the upper mount open to drill and later rivet it back up. I also had to do some of the smallest machining I have ever done. I turned 9 (need 8) rivets for the rubber seal in the vent frame. They were very small.



                              Here they are. Two left to do. These are for the rubber seal on the vent window side of the division bar I need to replace. I have yet to see if they are strong enough with being thinned out and reduced in diameter. The little corroded one up front there is what I am trying to duplicate.



                              I finished Todds adapter button for his Rapco brake rivet tool from Aircraft spruce company.



                              I will send it off Tuesday. Sorry I did not make it and get it sent before the long weekend there Todd. I had to go to Montana and back today. A very long day on the road. Their speed limit is 80 MPH! Sweeeet!


                              Photobucket is still giving me problems loading pic's. I just want to finish this build before they ruin this thread.
                              Last edited by Kaiserjeeps; 05-27-2018, 09:56 AM.
                              Melford1972 says...
                              I’d say I feel sorry for you, but I really don’t, Mr. “I-stumble-into-X-models-the-way-most-people-stumble-into-Toyota-Carollas.” 🤣
                              -----------------------
                              I make wag parts
                              1969 CJ-5 41 years owned
                              1969 1414X Wag in avocado mist
                              1970 1414X Wag in avocado mist
                              1968 M715 restomod
                              2001 Dodge 3500
                              2002 Toyota Tundra
                              2006 Toyota 4runner was Liz's, parked



                              Building a m715 over at the m715zone
                              Beloved wife Elizabeth Ann Temple Murdered by covid on Oct 19th 2021

                              Small violin, large amp

                              Comment

                              • 63J200atLSU
                                327 Rambler
                                • Jan 15, 2016
                                • 534

                                Originally posted by Kaiserjeeps
                                Photobucket is still giving me problems loading pic's. I just want to finish this build before they ruin this thread.
                                I actually read that the regime that was making their user experience so atrocious all got canned. I already switched to flickr and won't be going back, but I don't think your thread will die, at least!
                                '63 J200 Resto-mod in progress
                                (http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=178651)

                                If all goes well, we can toast to accidental successes.

                                I'm convinced I'm just too dumb to know that I can't restore this old truck...

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X